I think everyone's goal should be to find a no ADM dealer. I don't expect the used market to provide any deals either, if anything the used market might be worse than a $5-10k ADM especially the first MY. But you're right, only time will tell.
Dealerships Going to Squash Our Enthusiasm?
Looks like Nissan stealerships everywhere are destroying any enthusiasm the Z guys had with outrageous markups. These guys waited on lists and one that was mentioned even loaned his vintage Datsun Z for the Nissan commercial, and wasn’t given any assistance in purchasing a new one.
Keep in mind that the used car market just crashed which is bringing used car prices down and will draw attention away from new cars, but the chip shortage is causing new cars to be scarce as well, causing supply to be unnaturally low.
I don’t want to lose hope in our beloved GRC, and I trust Toyota, but will the stealerships do the same thing to us? Signs point to “waiting for the dust to settle before buying” as the best method…..Hoping I’m wrong.
Z Car Launch Terrible for Enthusiasts:
Current State of Used Car Market (prices dropping):
Keep in mind that the used car market just crashed which is bringing used car prices down and will draw attention away from new cars, but the chip shortage is causing new cars to be scarce as well, causing supply to be unnaturally low.
I don’t want to lose hope in our beloved GRC, and I trust Toyota, but will the stealerships do the same thing to us? Signs point to “waiting for the dust to settle before buying” as the best method…..Hoping I’m wrong.
Z Car Launch Terrible for Enthusiasts:
Current State of Used Car Market (prices dropping):
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Many Toyota dealerships will absolutely do the same kind of price gouging for the GR Corolla. They already do for existing models, notably 6MT GR86s. Sales figures put 6MT GR86 production numbers at around 3-4k per year for the US, so hopefully the higher production volume and MSRP of the GR Corolla, as well as the worsening economy will help us all get ours for MSRP or less. It'll just take a bit of patience.
The car market makes no sense at all here in New Zealand now either, EVERYONE is now trying to offload their used cars for silly prices that were more than the cost of a new one.
Take the GR Yaris, several have popped up for sale with "As new" crazy low mileage at silly prices but make no mistake they are NOT SELLING because why would you pay more for a 2 door tiny Yaris than a new Corolla ?
There may be a shortage of new cars but like I keep saying the economy is going to tank so hard that new cars will be sitting on the lot. Unless you are desperate because your current car just died just wait 6 months, the whole car market will fall on its face.
Take the GR Yaris, several have popped up for sale with "As new" crazy low mileage at silly prices but make no mistake they are NOT SELLING because why would you pay more for a 2 door tiny Yaris than a new Corolla ?
There may be a shortage of new cars but like I keep saying the economy is going to tank so hard that new cars will be sitting on the lot. Unless you are desperate because your current car just died just wait 6 months, the whole car market will fall on its face.
I would definitely pay more for a low mileage GR Yaris than a new Corolla 😄 for certain low production cars I really don't expect them to drop from their current values. They should plateau, but lower mileage Focus RS's are still selling over MSRP 4 yrs after production ended. I really don't expect any GR Corollas to be sitting on lots, unless they're in the showroom marked up $30k 💀The car market makes no sense at all here in New Zealand now either, EVERYONE is now trying to offload their used cars for silly prices that were more than the cost of a new one.
Take the GR Yaris, several have popped up for sale with "As new" crazy low mileage at silly prices but make no mistake they are NOT SELLING because why would you pay more for a 2 door tiny Yaris than a new Corolla ?
There may be a shortage of new cars but like I keep saying the economy is going to tank so hard that new cars will be sitting on the lot. Unless you are desperate because your current car just died just wait 6 months, the whole car market will fall on its face.
Yeah the GRY is an exception, i would fully expect good examples to go for high money.
Oh and in havent watched the videos, kinda reluctant to. A lot of online stuff can be sensationalised hand wringing to wrangle in the all mighty view count.
Oh and in havent watched the videos, kinda reluctant to. A lot of online stuff can be sensationalised hand wringing to wrangle in the all mighty view count.
I figured as much, that’s why I summarized both. But if it helps: the Z video begins with why he and the Z community were so excited about the car, then gives the story about the guy that loaned out the vintage Z for the commercial and received nothing for his contribution after waiting in line. He argues that Nissan is struggling and needs enthusiasts to build up enthusiasm around the brand, and this behavior of insane dealer markups is throttling enthusiasts from getting the cars that will now go to collectors who will hide them in their garages and not be seen daily. To back up his claims of insane markups and Nissan having sales issues, he then goes to his local lot that is almost devoid of vehicles to sell. Walking up to two SUVs on the lot, he indicates a 5k mark-up on each. And he reiterates his point that the car was marketed as an affordable sports car and dealer markups are killing that notion, while throttling sales to the enthusiasts that Nissan needs the cars to get to, in order to generate future sales for Nissan vehicles.Yeah the GRY is an exception, i would fully expect good examples to go for high money.
Oh and in havent watched the videos, kinda reluctant to. A lot of online stuff can be sensationalised hand wringing to wrangle in the all mighty view count.
The used car market video is from a father/son group I’ve been following for the last 3 months they also back themselves up with Blackbook sourced data. The father used to sell cars and brings a lot of that experience to the table When they do market analysis.
They're digging their own graves, but it's at the cost of the last great sports cars that will ever exist. Horrible, horrible timing.
I fear this will be the same result with the GRC and price me out of owning one. I've already contacted Toyota corporate about my concerns on how it's going to falsely show lack of interest for this product. They sent me a reply basically bushing it off and how manufacturer to dealer relationships don't allow Toyota to force the price. Blah blah blah. Missed my point entirely.
I fear this will be the same result with the GRC and price me out of owning one. I've already contacted Toyota corporate about my concerns on how it's going to falsely show lack of interest for this product. They sent me a reply basically bushing it off and how manufacturer to dealer relationships don't allow Toyota to force the price. Blah blah blah. Missed my point entirely.
Not all dealers care but the fact some people are dumb enough to pay is insane to meSo trolling a dealership for outrageous markups seemed to have worked for this dealership who was charging $90k over MSRP for a new C8 ZO6...
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We appear to have a new generation of people all over the world calling all sorts of different new cars "Classics" and "Collectors" before its even got to the dealers to be sold new.
People that are at the front of the que are clearly flipping these cars within months to try and make money on them.
I mean seriously who has things like "collectors car" and "its the best car I have ever driven" and raves about it but is selling in within a couple of months ?
This is all not helped by manufacturer's making limited edition car runs from the outset and causing FOMO.
Anyone paying $90k over never really earned that money, if you had to work hard for it you wouldn't be wasting it.
People that are at the front of the que are clearly flipping these cars within months to try and make money on them.
I mean seriously who has things like "collectors car" and "its the best car I have ever driven" and raves about it but is selling in within a couple of months ?
This is all not helped by manufacturer's making limited edition car runs from the outset and causing FOMO.
Anyone paying $90k over never really earned that money, if you had to work hard for it you wouldn't be wasting it.
People act as if depreciation starts from the value you paid with markup 😂😂😂Not all dealers care but the fact some people are dumb enough to pay is insane to me
Toyota dealers are no different than any other dealers. I assure you they will pull the same stunts. The fact is, they don't care. In their minds, profit supercedes customer satisfaction.
And they know they have the lobbying power to keep the dealership system the status quo for years to come. Manufacturers are powerless in this fight.
And they know they have the lobbying power to keep the dealership system the status quo for years to come. Manufacturers are powerless in this fight.
Yeesh, the car market and the economy are compounding issues. Any somewhat reliable used car up to 3 years old and sub 50K miles I am seeing marked 7-10K over MSRP. Same at dealerships with BS add ons and "market adjustments". Worst possible time to buy a car is right now.
There may have been a supply issue at first but I think dealers learned by having a restricted supply they can ask for more and get it. I'd bet currently supply is somewhat artificially restricted. I think current dealer behavior is shameful. Unfortunately consumers should be boycotting this craziness instead of enabling it. I think people just extend the length of financing and target the monthly cost vs total cost. Consumers are really getting screwed with the long term interest and overpriced purchase.
Used cars used to depreciate as you drove off the lot not the other way around. Ever. A lot of incoming repos and even more available supply as the likely recession and higher rates should cool the market. Also idiots who paid 10-15K$ over MSRP more than likely holding on to their vehicles a lot longer too. Less turn over, less demand again.
Find a decent dealer and negotiate a fair price. Wait a few months for delivery. Seems to be the only reasonable option currently. I'd bet the used market and new car shenanigans will be more rational in a couple years in general.
There may have been a supply issue at first but I think dealers learned by having a restricted supply they can ask for more and get it. I'd bet currently supply is somewhat artificially restricted. I think current dealer behavior is shameful. Unfortunately consumers should be boycotting this craziness instead of enabling it. I think people just extend the length of financing and target the monthly cost vs total cost. Consumers are really getting screwed with the long term interest and overpriced purchase.
Used cars used to depreciate as you drove off the lot not the other way around. Ever. A lot of incoming repos and even more available supply as the likely recession and higher rates should cool the market. Also idiots who paid 10-15K$ over MSRP more than likely holding on to their vehicles a lot longer too. Less turn over, less demand again.
Find a decent dealer and negotiate a fair price. Wait a few months for delivery. Seems to be the only reasonable option currently. I'd bet the used market and new car shenanigans will be more rational in a couple years in general.
Loads of GR Yaris over here for sale for more than a new one but people are not buying into it and why would you when they are listed for the same price as the new GR Corolla will be or some are still asking more than the price of a new Golf R so forget it.
In 6 months time we will be in the biggest financial meltdown in living memory and ICE car prices will slide into oblivion over the next 10 years.
In 6 months time we will be in the biggest financial meltdown in living memory and ICE car prices will slide into oblivion over the next 10 years.
There’s a reason why the Yaris is getting that kind of marketing.Loads of GR Yaris over here for sale for more than a new one but people are not buying into it and why would you when they are listed for the same price as the new GR Corolla will be or some are still asking more than the price of a new Golf R so forget it.
In 6 months time we will be in the biggest financial meltdown in living memory and ICE car prices will slide into oblivion over the next 10 years.
Anyone who pays more than MSRP for any car in my opinion has more money than brains.
I'm just glad dealerships in Canada cannot charge ADM's.
Good luck to all you gents in the states.
I'm just glad dealerships in Canada cannot charge ADM's.
Good luck to all you gents in the states.
The US customer doesn't seem to be as pragmatic as Australians or buyers in the UK. We have some uninformed and irrational consumers unfortunately. Sucks for someone who actually needs a car right now though.
I have been to the USA a few times, I call it the "Land of Extreme's" . You have the best of things but also all the worst of things. Great if you are a movie star but totally sucks at the other end of the spectrum.The US customer doesn't seem to be as pragmatic as Australians or buyers in the UK. We have some uninformed and irrational consumers unfortunately. Sucks for someone who actually needs a car right now though.
I have a friend in the car biz. He doesn’t sell them, but is privy to all sorts of reports and data that the consumer doesn’t see. He believes the runup of used prices is on its way out. He says banks refusing to finance inflated prices is one factor.
I want a GRC but don’t need it. I hope the rollout goes smoothly.
I want a GRC but don’t need it. I hope the rollout goes smoothly.
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